PDA

View Full Version : Are there studies that show that the Vest is a superior form of ACT?



LouLou
12-01-2009, 07:31 PM
If so how can Australia and Canada's health systems get away with not covering the Vest?
-----------------------------------------------------------
31 yr old female with cf (G551D and DF508) participating in Ph. 3 Vertex 770. Son with no symptoms and negative sweat test but positive for 2 mutations (G551D and S1235R).

LouLou
12-01-2009, 07:31 PM
If so how can Australia and Canada's health systems get away with not covering the Vest?
-----------------------------------------------------------
31 yr old female with cf (G551D and DF508) participating in Ph. 3 Vertex 770. Son with no symptoms and negative sweat test but positive for 2 mutations (G551D and S1235R).

LouLou
12-01-2009, 07:31 PM
If so how can Australia and Canada's health systems get away with not covering the Vest?
-----------------------------------------------------------
31 yr old female with cf (G551D and DF508) participating in Ph. 3 Vertex 770. Son with no symptoms and negative sweat test but positive for 2 mutations (G551D and S1235R).

LouLou
12-01-2009, 07:31 PM
If so how can Australia and Canada's health systems get away with not covering the Vest?
-----------------------------------------------------------
31 yr old female with cf (G551D and DF508) participating in Ph. 3 Vertex 770. Son with no symptoms and negative sweat test but positive for 2 mutations (G551D and S1235R).

LouLou
12-01-2009, 07:31 PM
If so how can Australia and Canada's health systems get away with not covering the Vest?
<br />-----------------------------------------------------------
<br />31 yr old female with cf (G551D and DF508) participating in Ph. 3 Vertex 770. Son with no symptoms and negative sweat test but positive for 2 mutations (G551D and S1235R).

hmw
12-01-2009, 07:48 PM
I know that Canada is running a Phase II trial right now in multiple centers comparing the vest (using the inCourage system) to PEP therapy. I wonder if he knows anything about how this is going or if a good outcome will help people get coverage of the vest in Canada.

hmw
12-01-2009, 07:48 PM
I know that Canada is running a Phase II trial right now in multiple centers comparing the vest (using the inCourage system) to PEP therapy. I wonder if he knows anything about how this is going or if a good outcome will help people get coverage of the vest in Canada.

hmw
12-01-2009, 07:48 PM
I know that Canada is running a Phase II trial right now in multiple centers comparing the vest (using the inCourage system) to PEP therapy. I wonder if he knows anything about how this is going or if a good outcome will help people get coverage of the vest in Canada.

hmw
12-01-2009, 07:48 PM
I know that Canada is running a Phase II trial right now in multiple centers comparing the vest (using the inCourage system) to PEP therapy. I wonder if he knows anything about how this is going or if a good outcome will help people get coverage of the vest in Canada.

hmw
12-01-2009, 07:48 PM
I know that Canada is running a Phase II trial right now in multiple centers comparing the vest (using the inCourage system) to PEP therapy. I wonder if he knows anything about how this is going or if a good outcome will help people get coverage of the vest in Canada.

LisaGreene
12-02-2009, 01:35 AM
When I was in Ireland doing a talk in April, this was a really big issue. Since my kids use a vest system, they were very curious about it's effectiveness. And, there was heated debate among many about whether or not the vest was as effective as manual cpt (which is what they use there).

I'll be interested in hearing what others on this side of the big pond have to say about this. :-)

LisaGreene
12-02-2009, 01:35 AM
When I was in Ireland doing a talk in April, this was a really big issue. Since my kids use a vest system, they were very curious about it's effectiveness. And, there was heated debate among many about whether or not the vest was as effective as manual cpt (which is what they use there).

I'll be interested in hearing what others on this side of the big pond have to say about this. :-)

LisaGreene
12-02-2009, 01:35 AM
When I was in Ireland doing a talk in April, this was a really big issue. Since my kids use a vest system, they were very curious about it's effectiveness. And, there was heated debate among many about whether or not the vest was as effective as manual cpt (which is what they use there).

I'll be interested in hearing what others on this side of the big pond have to say about this. :-)

LisaGreene
12-02-2009, 01:35 AM
When I was in Ireland doing a talk in April, this was a really big issue. Since my kids use a vest system, they were very curious about it's effectiveness. And, there was heated debate among many about whether or not the vest was as effective as manual cpt (which is what they use there).

I'll be interested in hearing what others on this side of the big pond have to say about this. :-)

LisaGreene
12-02-2009, 01:35 AM
When I was in Ireland doing a talk in April, this was a really big issue. Since my kids use a vest system, they were very curious about it's effectiveness. And, there was heated debate among many about whether or not the vest was as effective as manual cpt (which is what they use there).
<br />
<br />I'll be interested in hearing what others on this side of the big pond have to say about this. :-)

Littlemiss
12-02-2009, 07:16 AM
This was just discussed in the Adults forum, saveferris (Amy) has the evidence to date on her blog. I think our health system does not cover it b/c unfortunately the research available is not large or long-term enough to be considered more than pilot studies.

The vest is an expensive piece of equipment and as there are other comparible methods available the funding is not a priority. The USA free market health care system is more likely to purchase the vest, I assume b/c of how the product is marketed to the Dr's, thus Dr's are more likely to support it's use and push it through insurance. Do insurance companies require a level of evidence for an intervention before they pay for it?

I do think the pilot research has complelling results and wish I could try a Vest. Once I have had my baby I am going to trial one and look at pushing the funding through our federal Program of Appliances for Disabled People. I have worked in health care and have some inside knowledge that might help pull the right strings. If I can get it through there will be a precedent for other CF'rs

If that doesn't work I'll explore other campaining options.

I will let you all know how I go!

AJ

Littlemiss
12-02-2009, 07:16 AM
This was just discussed in the Adults forum, saveferris (Amy) has the evidence to date on her blog. I think our health system does not cover it b/c unfortunately the research available is not large or long-term enough to be considered more than pilot studies.

The vest is an expensive piece of equipment and as there are other comparible methods available the funding is not a priority. The USA free market health care system is more likely to purchase the vest, I assume b/c of how the product is marketed to the Dr's, thus Dr's are more likely to support it's use and push it through insurance. Do insurance companies require a level of evidence for an intervention before they pay for it?

I do think the pilot research has complelling results and wish I could try a Vest. Once I have had my baby I am going to trial one and look at pushing the funding through our federal Program of Appliances for Disabled People. I have worked in health care and have some inside knowledge that might help pull the right strings. If I can get it through there will be a precedent for other CF'rs

If that doesn't work I'll explore other campaining options.

I will let you all know how I go!

AJ

Littlemiss
12-02-2009, 07:16 AM
This was just discussed in the Adults forum, saveferris (Amy) has the evidence to date on her blog. I think our health system does not cover it b/c unfortunately the research available is not large or long-term enough to be considered more than pilot studies.

The vest is an expensive piece of equipment and as there are other comparible methods available the funding is not a priority. The USA free market health care system is more likely to purchase the vest, I assume b/c of how the product is marketed to the Dr's, thus Dr's are more likely to support it's use and push it through insurance. Do insurance companies require a level of evidence for an intervention before they pay for it?

I do think the pilot research has complelling results and wish I could try a Vest. Once I have had my baby I am going to trial one and look at pushing the funding through our federal Program of Appliances for Disabled People. I have worked in health care and have some inside knowledge that might help pull the right strings. If I can get it through there will be a precedent for other CF'rs

If that doesn't work I'll explore other campaining options.

I will let you all know how I go!

AJ

Littlemiss
12-02-2009, 07:16 AM
This was just discussed in the Adults forum, saveferris (Amy) has the evidence to date on her blog. I think our health system does not cover it b/c unfortunately the research available is not large or long-term enough to be considered more than pilot studies.

The vest is an expensive piece of equipment and as there are other comparible methods available the funding is not a priority. The USA free market health care system is more likely to purchase the vest, I assume b/c of how the product is marketed to the Dr's, thus Dr's are more likely to support it's use and push it through insurance. Do insurance companies require a level of evidence for an intervention before they pay for it?

I do think the pilot research has complelling results and wish I could try a Vest. Once I have had my baby I am going to trial one and look at pushing the funding through our federal Program of Appliances for Disabled People. I have worked in health care and have some inside knowledge that might help pull the right strings. If I can get it through there will be a precedent for other CF'rs

If that doesn't work I'll explore other campaining options.

I will let you all know how I go!

AJ

Littlemiss
12-02-2009, 07:16 AM
This was just discussed in the Adults forum, saveferris (Amy) has the evidence to date on her blog. I think our health system does not cover it b/c unfortunately the research available is not large or long-term enough to be considered more than pilot studies.
<br />
<br />The vest is an expensive piece of equipment and as there are other comparible methods available the funding is not a priority. The USA free market health care system is more likely to purchase the vest, I assume b/c of how the product is marketed to the Dr's, thus Dr's are more likely to support it's use and push it through insurance. Do insurance companies require a level of evidence for an intervention before they pay for it?
<br />
<br />I do think the pilot research has complelling results and wish I could try a Vest. Once I have had my baby I am going to trial one and look at pushing the funding through our federal Program of Appliances for Disabled People. I have worked in health care and have some inside knowledge that might help pull the right strings. If I can get it through there will be a precedent for other CF'rs
<br />
<br />If that doesn't work I'll explore other campaining options.
<br />
<br />I will let you all know how I go!
<br />
<br />AJ

Fran
12-02-2009, 09:47 AM
In Australia we can go to clinic for free, hospitalisations are free, prescriptions are heavily subsidised, particularly for children, we don't have the issue of insurance refusing to cover a medication. If a doctor prescribes it, we get it. This is without having any private health insurance AT ALL. If you are an Australian citizen, you are covered for all this.

So, without doing a lot of maths on it, I think we could be better off buying a vest for $15000, which I presume should last for some years, and getting all these other benefits for free, or in the case of prescriptions, subsidised.

I picked up six prescriptions for my son yesterday and paid $20.

I'm sure there are points for and against, but at the moment that's how I see it.

My son's doctor sees the vest as a "novelty". I don't know if he's right or wrong, but I do know that my son does not have one and has not been hospitalised with an exacerbation for four years. So, I'm not inclined to spend the $15000. That may change in the future, I'm keeping an open mind.

Fran
12-02-2009, 09:47 AM
In Australia we can go to clinic for free, hospitalisations are free, prescriptions are heavily subsidised, particularly for children, we don't have the issue of insurance refusing to cover a medication. If a doctor prescribes it, we get it. This is without having any private health insurance AT ALL. If you are an Australian citizen, you are covered for all this.

So, without doing a lot of maths on it, I think we could be better off buying a vest for $15000, which I presume should last for some years, and getting all these other benefits for free, or in the case of prescriptions, subsidised.

I picked up six prescriptions for my son yesterday and paid $20.

I'm sure there are points for and against, but at the moment that's how I see it.

My son's doctor sees the vest as a "novelty". I don't know if he's right or wrong, but I do know that my son does not have one and has not been hospitalised with an exacerbation for four years. So, I'm not inclined to spend the $15000. That may change in the future, I'm keeping an open mind.

Fran
12-02-2009, 09:47 AM
In Australia we can go to clinic for free, hospitalisations are free, prescriptions are heavily subsidised, particularly for children, we don't have the issue of insurance refusing to cover a medication. If a doctor prescribes it, we get it. This is without having any private health insurance AT ALL. If you are an Australian citizen, you are covered for all this.

So, without doing a lot of maths on it, I think we could be better off buying a vest for $15000, which I presume should last for some years, and getting all these other benefits for free, or in the case of prescriptions, subsidised.

I picked up six prescriptions for my son yesterday and paid $20.

I'm sure there are points for and against, but at the moment that's how I see it.

My son's doctor sees the vest as a "novelty". I don't know if he's right or wrong, but I do know that my son does not have one and has not been hospitalised with an exacerbation for four years. So, I'm not inclined to spend the $15000. That may change in the future, I'm keeping an open mind.

Fran
12-02-2009, 09:47 AM
In Australia we can go to clinic for free, hospitalisations are free, prescriptions are heavily subsidised, particularly for children, we don't have the issue of insurance refusing to cover a medication. If a doctor prescribes it, we get it. This is without having any private health insurance AT ALL. If you are an Australian citizen, you are covered for all this.

So, without doing a lot of maths on it, I think we could be better off buying a vest for $15000, which I presume should last for some years, and getting all these other benefits for free, or in the case of prescriptions, subsidised.

I picked up six prescriptions for my son yesterday and paid $20.

I'm sure there are points for and against, but at the moment that's how I see it.

My son's doctor sees the vest as a "novelty". I don't know if he's right or wrong, but I do know that my son does not have one and has not been hospitalised with an exacerbation for four years. So, I'm not inclined to spend the $15000. That may change in the future, I'm keeping an open mind.

Fran
12-02-2009, 09:47 AM
In Australia we can go to clinic for free, hospitalisations are free, prescriptions are heavily subsidised, particularly for children, we don't have the issue of insurance refusing to cover a medication. If a doctor prescribes it, we get it. This is without having any private health insurance AT ALL. If you are an Australian citizen, you are covered for all this.
<br />
<br />So, without doing a lot of maths on it, I think we could be better off buying a vest for $15000, which I presume should last for some years, and getting all these other benefits for free, or in the case of prescriptions, subsidised.
<br />
<br />I picked up six prescriptions for my son yesterday and paid $20.
<br />
<br />I'm sure there are points for and against, but at the moment that's how I see it.
<br />
<br />My son's doctor sees the vest as a "novelty". I don't know if he's right or wrong, but I do know that my son does not have one and has not been hospitalised with an exacerbation for four years. So, I'm not inclined to spend the $15000. That may change in the future, I'm keeping an open mind.

BUTTONSIRELAND
12-02-2009, 11:49 AM
At the clinic I attend in Ireland we follow the Australian model of care. So the vest isn't available to us (unless we decide to purchase it ourselves), we are given the option of the flutter or acapella.
We are getting a new consultant in the new year - (s)he is supposedly currently practising in the states so it will be interesting to see if (s)he will be changing our existing model.
Like Fran I have an open mind about the vest and would be willing to give it a try.

BUTTONSIRELAND
12-02-2009, 11:49 AM
At the clinic I attend in Ireland we follow the Australian model of care. So the vest isn't available to us (unless we decide to purchase it ourselves), we are given the option of the flutter or acapella.
We are getting a new consultant in the new year - (s)he is supposedly currently practising in the states so it will be interesting to see if (s)he will be changing our existing model.
Like Fran I have an open mind about the vest and would be willing to give it a try.

BUTTONSIRELAND
12-02-2009, 11:49 AM
At the clinic I attend in Ireland we follow the Australian model of care. So the vest isn't available to us (unless we decide to purchase it ourselves), we are given the option of the flutter or acapella.
We are getting a new consultant in the new year - (s)he is supposedly currently practising in the states so it will be interesting to see if (s)he will be changing our existing model.
Like Fran I have an open mind about the vest and would be willing to give it a try.

BUTTONSIRELAND
12-02-2009, 11:49 AM
At the clinic I attend in Ireland we follow the Australian model of care. So the vest isn't available to us (unless we decide to purchase it ourselves), we are given the option of the flutter or acapella.
We are getting a new consultant in the new year - (s)he is supposedly currently practising in the states so it will be interesting to see if (s)he will be changing our existing model.
Like Fran I have an open mind about the vest and would be willing to give it a try.

BUTTONSIRELAND
12-02-2009, 11:49 AM
At the clinic I attend in Ireland we follow the Australian model of care. So the vest isn't available to us (unless we decide to purchase it ourselves), we are given the option of the flutter or acapella.
<br />We are getting a new consultant in the new year - (s)he is supposedly currently practising in the states so it will be interesting to see if (s)he will be changing our existing model.
<br />Like Fran I have an open mind about the vest and would be willing to give it a try.

hmw
12-02-2009, 01:22 PM
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Do insurance companies require a level of evidence for an intervention before they pay for it?</end quote></div>
Yes, this does play a role. In our case when seeking approval for Emily's vest we were told that if it helps avoid even ONE hospitalization (keep in mind, one hospitalization over the course of many years due to the lifetime warranty on the vest once it's paid for!) it was in the insurance company's best interests to cover it, since the hospital stay would far exceed the cost of the vest.

If I am remembering study objectives correctly, the primary objective of the trial in Canada is to track the number of exacerbations over the period of one year in those using the vest vs. those using pep therapy. Part of why they want to do this is to determine the true 'cost' of the vest to whoever ends up paying for it, no doubt.

hmw
12-02-2009, 01:22 PM
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Do insurance companies require a level of evidence for an intervention before they pay for it?</end quote></div>
Yes, this does play a role. In our case when seeking approval for Emily's vest we were told that if it helps avoid even ONE hospitalization (keep in mind, one hospitalization over the course of many years due to the lifetime warranty on the vest once it's paid for!) it was in the insurance company's best interests to cover it, since the hospital stay would far exceed the cost of the vest.

If I am remembering study objectives correctly, the primary objective of the trial in Canada is to track the number of exacerbations over the period of one year in those using the vest vs. those using pep therapy. Part of why they want to do this is to determine the true 'cost' of the vest to whoever ends up paying for it, no doubt.

hmw
12-02-2009, 01:22 PM
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Do insurance companies require a level of evidence for an intervention before they pay for it?</end quote></div>
Yes, this does play a role. In our case when seeking approval for Emily's vest we were told that if it helps avoid even ONE hospitalization (keep in mind, one hospitalization over the course of many years due to the lifetime warranty on the vest once it's paid for!) it was in the insurance company's best interests to cover it, since the hospital stay would far exceed the cost of the vest.

If I am remembering study objectives correctly, the primary objective of the trial in Canada is to track the number of exacerbations over the period of one year in those using the vest vs. those using pep therapy. Part of why they want to do this is to determine the true 'cost' of the vest to whoever ends up paying for it, no doubt.

hmw
12-02-2009, 01:22 PM
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Do insurance companies require a level of evidence for an intervention before they pay for it?</end quote>
Yes, this does play a role. In our case when seeking approval for Emily's vest we were told that if it helps avoid even ONE hospitalization (keep in mind, one hospitalization over the course of many years due to the lifetime warranty on the vest once it's paid for!) it was in the insurance company's best interests to cover it, since the hospital stay would far exceed the cost of the vest.

If I am remembering study objectives correctly, the primary objective of the trial in Canada is to track the number of exacerbations over the period of one year in those using the vest vs. those using pep therapy. Part of why they want to do this is to determine the true 'cost' of the vest to whoever ends up paying for it, no doubt.

hmw
12-02-2009, 01:22 PM
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Do insurance companies require a level of evidence for an intervention before they pay for it?</end quote>
<br />Yes, this does play a role. In our case when seeking approval for Emily's vest we were told that if it helps avoid even ONE hospitalization (keep in mind, one hospitalization over the course of many years due to the lifetime warranty on the vest once it's paid for!) it was in the insurance company's best interests to cover it, since the hospital stay would far exceed the cost of the vest.
<br />
<br />If I am remembering study objectives correctly, the primary objective of the trial in Canada is to track the number of exacerbations over the period of one year in those using the vest vs. those using pep therapy. Part of why they want to do this is to determine the true 'cost' of the vest to whoever ends up paying for it, no doubt.

Brad
12-02-2009, 02:01 PM
Just an opinion from a Ole Cfer.
There is Nothing better than Real Manual Chest PT
IF it is done CORRECTLY by a good strong RT.

A Well Trained RT with the Drive to Perform Well can't be Beat! Pun Intended.

I have the Vest and the PEP .

Brad
12-02-2009, 02:01 PM
Just an opinion from a Ole Cfer.
There is Nothing better than Real Manual Chest PT
IF it is done CORRECTLY by a good strong RT.

A Well Trained RT with the Drive to Perform Well can't be Beat! Pun Intended.

I have the Vest and the PEP .

Brad
12-02-2009, 02:01 PM
Just an opinion from a Ole Cfer.
There is Nothing better than Real Manual Chest PT
IF it is done CORRECTLY by a good strong RT.

A Well Trained RT with the Drive to Perform Well can't be Beat! Pun Intended.

I have the Vest and the PEP .

Brad
12-02-2009, 02:01 PM
Just an opinion from a Ole Cfer.
There is Nothing better than Real Manual Chest PT
IF it is done CORRECTLY by a good strong RT.

A Well Trained RT with the Drive to Perform Well can't be Beat! Pun Intended.

I have the Vest and the PEP .

Brad
12-02-2009, 02:01 PM
Just an opinion from a Ole Cfer.
<br /> There is Nothing better than Real Manual Chest PT
<br /> IF it is done CORRECTLY by a good strong RT.
<br />
<br /> A Well Trained RT with the Drive to Perform Well can't be Beat! Pun Intended.
<br />
<br /> I have the Vest and the PEP .

ymikhale
12-03-2009, 07:36 AM
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote><i>Originally posted by: <b>Brad</b></i>

Just an opinion from a Ole Cfer.

There is Nothing better than Real Manual Chest PT

IF it is done CORRECTLY by a good strong RT.



A Well Trained RT with the Drive to Perform Well can't be Beat! Pun Intended.



I have the Vest and the PEP .</end quote></div>

I could not agree more. My daughter had what turned out to be a bad RT. Kept saying she was fine and since she was not coughing I had no reason to question that. Then we did sputum culture, hospital RT said she was congested, ours kept saying she was fine. In the end it turned out she had infection with staph and some pseudo. Needless to say we switched RTs.

ymikhale
12-03-2009, 07:36 AM
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote><i>Originally posted by: <b>Brad</b></i>

Just an opinion from a Ole Cfer.

There is Nothing better than Real Manual Chest PT

IF it is done CORRECTLY by a good strong RT.



A Well Trained RT with the Drive to Perform Well can't be Beat! Pun Intended.



I have the Vest and the PEP .</end quote></div>

I could not agree more. My daughter had what turned out to be a bad RT. Kept saying she was fine and since she was not coughing I had no reason to question that. Then we did sputum culture, hospital RT said she was congested, ours kept saying she was fine. In the end it turned out she had infection with staph and some pseudo. Needless to say we switched RTs.

ymikhale
12-03-2009, 07:36 AM
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote><i>Originally posted by: <b>Brad</b></i>

Just an opinion from a Ole Cfer.

There is Nothing better than Real Manual Chest PT

IF it is done CORRECTLY by a good strong RT.



A Well Trained RT with the Drive to Perform Well can't be Beat! Pun Intended.



I have the Vest and the PEP .</end quote></div>

I could not agree more. My daughter had what turned out to be a bad RT. Kept saying she was fine and since she was not coughing I had no reason to question that. Then we did sputum culture, hospital RT said she was congested, ours kept saying she was fine. In the end it turned out she had infection with staph and some pseudo. Needless to say we switched RTs.

ymikhale
12-03-2009, 07:36 AM
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote><i>Originally posted by: <b>Brad</b></i>

Just an opinion from a Ole Cfer.

There is Nothing better than Real Manual Chest PT

IF it is done CORRECTLY by a good strong RT.



A Well Trained RT with the Drive to Perform Well can't be Beat! Pun Intended.



I have the Vest and the PEP .</end quote>

I could not agree more. My daughter had what turned out to be a bad RT. Kept saying she was fine and since she was not coughing I had no reason to question that. Then we did sputum culture, hospital RT said she was congested, ours kept saying she was fine. In the end it turned out she had infection with staph and some pseudo. Needless to say we switched RTs.

ymikhale
12-03-2009, 07:36 AM
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote><i>Originally posted by: <b>Brad</b></i>
<br />
<br />Just an opinion from a Ole Cfer.
<br />
<br /> There is Nothing better than Real Manual Chest PT
<br />
<br /> IF it is done CORRECTLY by a good strong RT.
<br />
<br />
<br />
<br /> A Well Trained RT with the Drive to Perform Well can't be Beat! Pun Intended.
<br />
<br />
<br />
<br /> I have the Vest and the PEP .</end quote>
<br />
<br />I could not agree more. My daughter had what turned out to be a bad RT. Kept saying she was fine and since she was not coughing I had no reason to question that. Then we did sputum culture, hospital RT said she was congested, ours kept saying she was fine. In the end it turned out she had infection with staph and some pseudo. Needless to say we switched RTs.

LisaGreene
12-08-2009, 09:58 PM
This is such an interesting conversation! And, my question is this: What is the value of having independence, a way of doing CPT on one's own without relying on others, and the convenience?

In my opinion, I think there are pros and cons for all systems but, whatever one chooses, consistency and adherence is the key. If a vest or a PEP or a RT makes a person more likely to comply for whatever reason, then I personally think there is alot of value in that even if there is no hugely compelling evidence for one being better than another. So, I am very grateful that there are many different systems available so that my kids have choices.

Just my opinion- I am not "vested" (ha ha) in any particular approach except: Take good care of yourselves, follow doctors orders and do what ya gotta do to stay healthy.

Hugs!
Lisa G

LisaGreene
12-08-2009, 09:58 PM
This is such an interesting conversation! And, my question is this: What is the value of having independence, a way of doing CPT on one's own without relying on others, and the convenience?

In my opinion, I think there are pros and cons for all systems but, whatever one chooses, consistency and adherence is the key. If a vest or a PEP or a RT makes a person more likely to comply for whatever reason, then I personally think there is alot of value in that even if there is no hugely compelling evidence for one being better than another. So, I am very grateful that there are many different systems available so that my kids have choices.

Just my opinion- I am not "vested" (ha ha) in any particular approach except: Take good care of yourselves, follow doctors orders and do what ya gotta do to stay healthy.

Hugs!
Lisa G

LisaGreene
12-08-2009, 09:58 PM
This is such an interesting conversation! And, my question is this: What is the value of having independence, a way of doing CPT on one's own without relying on others, and the convenience?

In my opinion, I think there are pros and cons for all systems but, whatever one chooses, consistency and adherence is the key. If a vest or a PEP or a RT makes a person more likely to comply for whatever reason, then I personally think there is alot of value in that even if there is no hugely compelling evidence for one being better than another. So, I am very grateful that there are many different systems available so that my kids have choices.

Just my opinion- I am not "vested" (ha ha) in any particular approach except: Take good care of yourselves, follow doctors orders and do what ya gotta do to stay healthy.

Hugs!
Lisa G

LisaGreene
12-08-2009, 09:58 PM
This is such an interesting conversation! And, my question is this: What is the value of having independence, a way of doing CPT on one's own without relying on others, and the convenience?

In my opinion, I think there are pros and cons for all systems but, whatever one chooses, consistency and adherence is the key. If a vest or a PEP or a RT makes a person more likely to comply for whatever reason, then I personally think there is alot of value in that even if there is no hugely compelling evidence for one being better than another. So, I am very grateful that there are many different systems available so that my kids have choices.

Just my opinion- I am not "vested" (ha ha) in any particular approach except: Take good care of yourselves, follow doctors orders and do what ya gotta do to stay healthy.

Hugs!
Lisa G

LisaGreene
12-08-2009, 09:58 PM
This is such an interesting conversation! And, my question is this: What is the value of having independence, a way of doing CPT on one's own without relying on others, and the convenience?
<br />
<br />In my opinion, I think there are pros and cons for all systems but, whatever one chooses, consistency and adherence is the key. If a vest or a PEP or a RT makes a person more likely to comply for whatever reason, then I personally think there is alot of value in that even if there is no hugely compelling evidence for one being better than another. So, I am very grateful that there are many different systems available so that my kids have choices.
<br />
<br />Just my opinion- I am not "vested" (ha ha) in any particular approach except: Take good care of yourselves, follow doctors orders and do what ya gotta do to stay healthy.
<br />
<br />Hugs!
<br />Lisa G

Sarasmamma
05-03-2010, 11:34 AM
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote><i>Originally posted by: <b>Fran</b></i>

<b>In Australia we can go to clinic for free, hospitalisations are free, prescriptions are heavily subsidised, particularly for children, we don't have the issue of insurance refusing to cover a medication. </b> If a doctor prescribes it, we get it. This is without having any private health insurance AT ALL. If you are an Australian citizen, you are covered for all this.



So, without doing a lot of maths on it, I think we could be better off buying a vest for $15000, which I presume should last for some years, and getting all these other benefits for free, or in the case of prescriptions, subsidised.



I picked up six prescriptions for my son yesterday and paid $20.



I'm sure there are points for and against, but at the moment that's how I see it.



My son's doctor sees the vest as a "novelty". I don't know if he's right or wrong, but I do know that my son does not have one and has not been hospitalised with an exacerbation for four years. So, I'm not inclined to spend the $15000. That may change in the future, I'm keeping an open mind.</end quote></div>

I think we have similar health care in Norway? We also get all we need for free til age 12 and some cases 18 or life through, but not always is what doc. prescribes covered and needs to be applied for to get covered. Stuff like gym mats, ergo balls, and other help for physical therapy is free "lend out" for those who need it. (papers sais you are borrowing), but it's all brand new and yours as long as you need it.
With CF we have to apply for most meds and vitamins because it is less than 300 people with CF in Norway and the meds are unregistered.

Sarasmamma
05-03-2010, 11:34 AM
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote><i>Originally posted by: <b>Fran</b></i>

<b>In Australia we can go to clinic for free, hospitalisations are free, prescriptions are heavily subsidised, particularly for children, we don't have the issue of insurance refusing to cover a medication. </b> If a doctor prescribes it, we get it. This is without having any private health insurance AT ALL. If you are an Australian citizen, you are covered for all this.



So, without doing a lot of maths on it, I think we could be better off buying a vest for $15000, which I presume should last for some years, and getting all these other benefits for free, or in the case of prescriptions, subsidised.



I picked up six prescriptions for my son yesterday and paid $20.



I'm sure there are points for and against, but at the moment that's how I see it.



My son's doctor sees the vest as a "novelty". I don't know if he's right or wrong, but I do know that my son does not have one and has not been hospitalised with an exacerbation for four years. So, I'm not inclined to spend the $15000. That may change in the future, I'm keeping an open mind.</end quote>

I think we have similar health care in Norway? We also get all we need for free til age 12 and some cases 18 or life through, but not always is what doc. prescribes covered and needs to be applied for to get covered. Stuff like gym mats, ergo balls, and other help for physical therapy is free "lend out" for those who need it. (papers sais you are borrowing), but it's all brand new and yours as long as you need it.
With CF we have to apply for most meds and vitamins because it is less than 300 people with CF in Norway and the meds are unregistered.

Sarasmamma
05-03-2010, 11:34 AM
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote><i>Originally posted by: <b>Fran</b></i>
<br />
<br /><b>In Australia we can go to clinic for free, hospitalisations are free, prescriptions are heavily subsidised, particularly for children, we don't have the issue of insurance refusing to cover a medication. </b> If a doctor prescribes it, we get it. This is without having any private health insurance AT ALL. If you are an Australian citizen, you are covered for all this.
<br />
<br />
<br />
<br />So, without doing a lot of maths on it, I think we could be better off buying a vest for $15000, which I presume should last for some years, and getting all these other benefits for free, or in the case of prescriptions, subsidised.
<br />
<br />
<br />
<br />I picked up six prescriptions for my son yesterday and paid $20.
<br />
<br />
<br />
<br />I'm sure there are points for and against, but at the moment that's how I see it.
<br />
<br />
<br />
<br />My son's doctor sees the vest as a "novelty". I don't know if he's right or wrong, but I do know that my son does not have one and has not been hospitalised with an exacerbation for four years. So, I'm not inclined to spend the $15000. That may change in the future, I'm keeping an open mind.</end quote>
<br />
<br />I think we have similar health care in Norway? We also get all we need for free til age 12 and some cases 18 or life through, but not always is what doc. prescribes covered and needs to be applied for to get covered. Stuff like gym mats, ergo balls, and other help for physical therapy is free "lend out" for those who need it. (papers sais you are borrowing), but it's all brand new and yours as long as you need it.
<br />With CF we have to apply for most meds and vitamins because it is less than 300 people with CF in Norway and the meds are unregistered.

tjohnston
04-08-2011, 02:57 AM
Just remember that the companies will work with you on the price if you do not have insurance.

tjohnston
04-08-2011, 02:57 AM
Just remember that the companies will work with you on the price if you do not have insurance.

tjohnston
04-08-2011, 02:57 AM
Just remember that the companies will work with you on the price if you do not have insurance.

tjohnston
04-08-2011, 03:01 AM
Unfortunately, you usually cannot take home that stong RT. And we wear out! The good thing about vest therapy is that you are able to get percussion in all lobes at the same time! And for a large amount of patients, it is more tolerable than old fashioned hand CPT.

tjohnston
04-08-2011, 03:01 AM
Unfortunately, you usually cannot take home that stong RT. And we wear out! The good thing about vest therapy is that you are able to get percussion in all lobes at the same time! And for a large amount of patients, it is more tolerable than old fashioned hand CPT.

tjohnston
04-08-2011, 03:01 AM
Unfortunately, you usually cannot take home that stong RT. And we wear out! The good thing about vest therapy is that you are able to get percussion in all lobes at the same time! And for a large amount of patients, it is more tolerable than old fashioned hand CPT.

lizlas
08-31-2011, 01:39 PM
<P>thats what i was wondering Brad...if manual CPT is better than vest!&nbsp; the pep/ flutter acapella &nbsp;dont work that well for me....I need the old fashioned way....CPT...but husband has bad elbows and it really hurts him after 10 mins.....</P>
<P>I also have the huge percussor....needless to say hard to do my back.....I would love to try a vest.</P>
<P>in Ontario we have ADP assistance devices program thru goverment ....they pay 75 % of compressors and percussors etc. and we or our work insurance pay the 25%. when I called&nbsp;ADP&nbsp;and asked if they heard of the vest for CF physio....oh she heard of it alright ...but NO COVERAGE......there are a few people at my clinic in toronto who have paid for vest themselves....but my dr. says they were disappointed ...mannual cpt was better .&nbsp; and there didnt seem to be a decline in their&nbsp; frequency of exasberations...but i didnt get to speak with them...</P>
<P>I know one ladies private work insurance paid for vest for her son...she threatened to put her story in newspaper...no dont want to do that...lol</P>
<P>few years ago when I called about vest . dont remeber which co. they offered it to me for 12,000 ....or rent it for 1,000 a month.....to try it....</P>
<P>how many vest companies are there?</P>
<P>&nbsp;</P>
<P>&nbsp;</P>

lizlas
08-31-2011, 01:39 PM
<P>thats what i was wondering Brad...if manual CPT is better than vest! the pep/ flutter acapella dont work that well for me....I need the old fashioned way....CPT...but husband has bad elbows and it really hurts him after 10 mins.....</P>
<P>I also have the huge percussor....needless to say hard to do my back.....I would love to try a vest.</P>
<P>in Ontario we have ADP assistance devices program thru goverment ....they pay 75 % of compressors and percussors etc. and we or our work insurance pay the 25%. when I calledADPand asked if they heard of the vest for CF physio....oh she heard of it alright ...but NO COVERAGE......there are a few people at my clinic in toronto who have paid for vest themselves....but my dr. says they were disappointed ...mannual cpt was better . and there didnt seem to be a decline in their frequency of exasberations...but i didnt get to speak with them...</P>
<P>I know one ladies private work insurance paid for vest for her son...she threatened to put her story in newspaper...no dont want to do that...lol</P>
<P>few years ago when I called about vest . dont remeber which co. they offered it to me for 12,000 ....or rent it for 1,000 a month.....to try it....</P>
<P>how many vest companies are there?</P>
<P></P>
<P></P>

lizlas
08-31-2011, 01:39 PM
<P>thats what i was wondering Brad...if manual CPT is better than vest! the pep/ flutter acapella dont work that well for me....I need the old fashioned way....CPT...but husband has bad elbows and it really hurts him after 10 mins.....</P>
<P>I also have the huge percussor....needless to say hard to do my back.....I would love to try a vest.</P>
<P>in Ontario we have ADP assistance devices program thru goverment ....they pay 75 % of compressors and percussors etc. and we or our work insurance pay the 25%. when I calledADPand asked if they heard of the vest for CF physio....oh she heard of it alright ...but NO COVERAGE......there are a few people at my clinic in toronto who have paid for vest themselves....but my dr. says they were disappointed ...mannual cpt was better . and there didnt seem to be a decline in their frequency of exasberations...but i didnt get to speak with them...</P>
<P>I know one ladies private work insurance paid for vest for her son...she threatened to put her story in newspaper...no dont want to do that...lol</P>
<P>few years ago when I called about vest . dont remeber which co. they offered it to me for 12,000 ....or rent it for 1,000 a month.....to try it....</P>
<P>how many vest companies are there?</P>
<P></P>
<P></P>

00transam
09-09-2011, 07:59 PM
<br>My doctor pushed for me to get the vest, so I finally did get one. The one I have is considered one of the best but even on 100% I don't get anywhere near as much if any at times out compared to the manual cpt. I still try to use the vest but it honestly does NOT work as well as manual cpt. Now they have me trying a new pulsed breathing machine with nebs, so foar it seems to show some promise.

00transam
09-09-2011, 07:59 PM
<br>My doctor pushed for me to get the vest, so I finally did get one. The one I have is considered one of the best but even on 100% I don't get anywhere near as much if any at times out compared to the manual cpt. I still try to use the vest but it honestly does NOT work as well as manual cpt. Now they have me trying a new pulsed breathing machine with nebs, so foar it seems to show some promise.

00transam
09-09-2011, 07:59 PM
<br>My doctor pushed for me to get the vest, so I finally did get one. The one I have is considered one of the best but even on 100% I don't get anywhere near as much if any at times out compared to the manual cpt. I still try to use the vest but it honestly does NOT work as well as manual cpt. Now they have me trying a new pulsed breathing machine with nebs, so foar it seems to show some promise.

imported_Momto2
04-19-2012, 12:43 PM
Yes, what brad said : )

imported_Momto2
04-19-2012, 12:43 PM
Yes, what brad said : )

00transam
10-15-2012, 09:01 PM
I remember when the VEST was supposed to be the new big thing to replace manual PT, it isn't and doesn't. My care center recommended the VEST fully and my insurance got me a really good one but it has NEVER done as good as the manual therapy. When I am in for a stay at my care center they still prefer to do the manual PT, that should speak for itself. Some prefer the VEST but usually only because they don't like the pounding on themselves or they're children. Most of the CF people I run into admit the manual PT still works the best even if they "like" the VEST.

CyrilCrodius
10-28-2012, 08:25 PM
The rationale behind it is to avoid paying huge bucks when a cheaper alternative exists that is just as effective.